Fred Jones, you get the feeling, prides himself on not pulling any punches in every aspect of his business. It always tests an interviewer's skill when they have to carefully pick out the things that will probably get them a call from someone's lawyer before it ends up in print.

But that attitude seems to be a big part of what has made the company undeniably successful. In 25 years, Jones has built it up from the back of a delivery van to £12m worth of sales and an impressive factory and warehouse in his native Middlesborough. It has just invested £4m in top of the range cutting equipment, doubled its workforce to 80 and won a North East Business Award for it's contribution to the local economy.

It's certainly true that the market for granite and natural stone has grown significantly in that time but like all natural materials quality can vary by huge margins and it is this strive to convince his customers to buy on quality rather than price that drives his business today.

Q&A

Q. What's the F Jones Cleveland story? How did the company start?

A. It's been 25 years now, and I set out having to make a living because of poverty really. I'm one of eight kids and my father had a brain tumor when I was 21, he couldn't work and they lost everything. I had to go out to work to buy them a house, because the one they were in had been repossessed, and set up a house of my own with my wife Valerie.
The only thing I knew was antiques, my father had taught me that, so I started doing antique fairs and ended up flogging architectural pieces. From that I went into selling fireplaces with a partner and we were pretty successful trading with major builders like Wimpey. I started importing marble from Portugal and did the occasional bathroom.
My partner and I went our separate ways in the early 1990s and I started again. I had nothing in this business at all, but we grew it on the principle that if I wouldn't have it in my house I wouldn't sell it.

Q. What was the turning point? When did you know you'd be ok?

A. I always knew we'd be ok, life wasn't easy but hard work makes you ok. I suppose as wider interest grew in the products I wanted to sell - marble bathrooms, kitchen worktops - we continued to grow. So year after year we've had constant growth ever since.

Q. The market has changed in your favour too, interest in stone has become mass market.

A. I saw the market early, and we have a different philosophy to other companies in that we look after our customers. We're not here to make money for the sake of it, if you look after your customers you'll grow the company naturally.
I knew it would expand, if you look abroad everyone uses it, so it had to come over here eventually. We've become a more wasteful and frivolous society, if you move into a new house you don't want to keep Mrs Smith's kitchen even if it's perfectly fine, you want a new one. Now people want to pamper themselves with products, it's aspiration.

Q. How much does the retailer understand the materials you're selling?

A. They have very, very little knowledge, simply because there are very few people you can go to and get knowledge from. Much of our market is full of dealers who don't know the industry, haven't been in it for 25 years and many of them are granite fitters who think 'I can do that' and rent a unit and lease a couple of machines and undercut their neighbour by £600. They don't have backup to deal with the best suppliers and form a relationship with them and use their expertise to get the best information.

Q. And do they understand that it's a natural material and so will have flaws?

A. When anybody complains about their bit of granite having a flaw in it, I say 'they all do, it's perfectly acceptable, it's a natural material'. I had to go and see a punter the other night as a favour to one of my customers and there was a tiny little hairline mark in this immaculate piece of granite and he wanted it all replaced - I explained to them it was volcanic and had natural features but he kept shouting that we were baffling him with science. I didn't get anywhere with him.

Q. How much of your sales is basic black granite?

A. Not as much as you think. We're trying to move people away from black granite. It's back to understanding the material, we want the retailers, designers and specifiers to bring their customers to our factory and show them slabs. We get so many people coming in here who think all granite is black but leave with something different because they're enthused.

Q. Education again, customers just lack knowledge

A. Yes, but having said that we're now noticeably at the stage where granite has been around for five years and they're starting to say 'I've seen Baltic Brown, I've seen African Black, I want something different.'

Q. Where is the stone from?

A. Usually Brazil, Madagascar, enormous quantities from the US, India. We don't touch Chinese stone, the quality is too poor. The polishing isn't bright enough and the slabs aren't calibrated - 28mm at one end, 30mm in the middle and 32mm at the other end - totally useless. Our suppliers in Italy are reliable and use only the best machines. I could spend 15 - 20% less with other suppliers but I'll stick with them as it minimises our wastage.

Q. Are there different grades of granite?

A. There aren't different qualities, there are different types, they're all polished to the same quality but they polish at different rates. So some are very hard and will polish hard and bright, some will have lots of minerals and you'll see bright, then flat, bright, then flat. It's just different materials. .

Q. You obviously put huge importance in your staff, in a positive way it's a very old fashioned
approach.

A. You have to do that in this industry. In Italy, there might be 20 little companies in every town, but they tend to employ two or three men. So if one wants to employ another saw man, they know where they can get them. We can't do that here, we have to train them. Every aspect of our growth is measured by how quickly we can create the staff.

Q. And that's why you clearly want to give people a job for life - you help them with their mortgage, their pensions and other advice.

A. Absolutely, I don't want them to be poor. You can't come to work and then go home and worry about paying your electric bill because you won't be working properly. I always think they need to be paid properly and treated like human beings, they're no different to me, and hopefully they will respond in kind and have respect for us and the company and do their best when they're working.

Q. Is it easy to describe the F Jones Cleveland customer?

A. Successful, interesting kitchen showrooms. They use interesting shapes and colours of granite, you can pick them out from the drawings we're sent. They're trying new things and new designs and, as a result, they're trying to get the higher value kitchen. If you go to the ordinary companies, all they do is produce rectangles, possibly because they don't know what we can produce - but if you can draw it, we can manufacture it.